tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post2243849058833587309..comments2024-02-19T07:51:46.118-05:00Comments on Throw Grammar from the Train: Keeping the "suck" in "successful"Janhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03173219179480606941noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-87543279700990682802012-12-05T13:32:59.847-05:002012-12-05T13:32:59.847-05:00With a recent poll showing that 49% of Rs favor se...With a recent poll showing that 49% of Rs favor secession, several news commentators have failed to resist the punny "Nothing secedes like secession."Gregory Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11293280236115306205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-47528253203282377252012-11-27T05:50:58.840-05:002012-11-27T05:50:58.840-05:00For the record, as a British person, I found this ...For the record, as a British person, I found this all very interesting...<br /><br />My pronunciations of these words are as follows:<br /><br />flaccid = 'flassid'<br />schedule = 'sked-yule'<br />succint - 'suck-sinkt'<br />access = 'ack-sess'<br />accessible = 'ack-sessible'<br /><br />The example I find strange is that of 'schedule'... I've only ever come across the 'shedule' pronunciation with non-British sources, so find the 'faux-British' comment really peculiar.<br /><br />It's all very interesting, to say the least.<br /><br />Hermhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02737378892480531236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-43969393469577350022012-11-26T19:24:23.938-05:002012-11-26T19:24:23.938-05:00DkuVdc [url=http://ukbootshopon.com/]cheap ugg boo...DkuVdc [url=http://ukbootshopon.com/]cheap ugg boots[/url] SxnXrd http://ukbootshopon.com/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-11593489678687837372012-11-25T05:40:43.952-05:002012-11-25T05:40:43.952-05:00I suspect that "sussinkt" is the norm in...I suspect that "sussinkt" is the norm in Australian English - but that is just my guess, no data can be produced to support this assertion. Anybody else noticed?<br /><br />It's certainly easier/quicker to say.cpnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-64718439850770506592012-11-24T01:15:54.263-05:002012-11-24T01:15:54.263-05:00It's been "sussinct" and "flass...It's been "sussinct" and "flassid" for my 60+ years of speaking. My native English is a blend of New England and Michigan.John Burgesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11979918255430186425noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-55774376022481468692012-11-23T21:48:28.652-05:002012-11-23T21:48:28.652-05:00I've always pronounced succinct as "sussi...I've always pronounced succinct as "sussinct" and will say that aurally it exemplifies its definition better than its traditional pronunciation; perhaps to allow the listener to more easily suss out its meaning? limssejhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11971328083939357803noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-45513505416829672362012-11-23T21:48:14.705-05:002012-11-23T21:48:14.705-05:00I've always pronounced succinct as "sussi...I've always pronounced succinct as "sussinct" and will say that aurally it exemplifies its definition better than its traditional pronunciation; perhaps to allow the listener to more easily suss out its meaning? limssejhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11971328083939357803noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-73646654712007523932012-11-23T09:40:05.071-05:002012-11-23T09:40:05.071-05:00LOL, I always want to ask if people who say "...LOL, I always want to ask if people who say "shedule" learned how to say it that way in shool...CaitieCatnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-19839912260727233762012-11-19T21:00:30.136-05:002012-11-19T21:00:30.136-05:00It's possible that an earlier English pronunci...It's possible that an earlier English pronunciation had "sed", but I have my doubts. The source form is given as O.Fr. <i>cedule</i>, which would have had "ke" in Latin and would now be "se" in modern French. The way this change usually works is "ke" > "che" > "she" > "se", so it could have been "sh" at the time it was borrowed, depending on just how far the change had proceeded by the time of O. Fr. I wasn't able to find out about the pronunciation of "ce" in O.Fr.Gregory Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11293280236115306205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-50345777659683537592012-11-19T19:41:12.043-05:002012-11-19T19:41:12.043-05:00I think I read somewhere that "sed-yul" ...I think I read somewhere that "sed-yul" (which nobody says nowadays) is the older pronunciation, or at least that it would be truer to the word's origins.emptyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04513102801380602436noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-7583444509163966382012-11-19T10:22:57.059-05:002012-11-19T10:22:57.059-05:00Online Etymological Dictionary says "the mode...Online Etymological Dictionary says "the modern British pronunciation ("shed-yul") is from French influence, while the U.S. pronunciation ("sked-yul") is from the practice of Webster, and is based on the Greek original."<br /><br />So the change was from "shed" to "sked" and was a scholarly restoration, in English, but previously the "k" had been lost in Old French before the borrowing into English.<br /><br />http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?allowed_in_frame=0&search=schedule&searchmode=noneGregory Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11293280236115306205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-4685044126050666052012-11-19T00:30:29.812-05:002012-11-19T00:30:29.812-05:00Hmmm, maybe this is some kind of Faux-British affe...Hmmm, maybe this is some kind of Faux-British affectation going on here. People hear the hard "c" sound dropped in "schedule" and perhaps they assume that they'll sound a bit more cultured and refined if they drop it elsewhere as well. Stranger things have happened, have they not?<br /><br />On the other hand, I've always pronounced "flaccid" as "flassid", and I never knew that there was any other way of saying it. Bryan Whitehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01607046468663026271noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-50831510248038719232012-11-18T14:19:50.415-05:002012-11-18T14:19:50.415-05:00empty said: "Gregory, are you suggesting that...<b>empty</b> said: "Gregory, are you suggesting that even words in which the ks sound is spelled x can sometimes be subject to the same loss of k sound?"<br /><br />It hadn't occurred to me that the spelling had anything to do with it. (Linguists don't do spelling.) It did occur to me that whether <i>k</i> is from a Latinate prefix, like ad-, might be important, since such prefixes have some phonological peculiarities (like permitting word-initial unstressed closed syllables).Gregory Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11293280236115306205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-66424361721795292382012-11-18T11:06:36.695-05:002012-11-18T11:06:36.695-05:00Jan:
I've heard sus-sink and flas-sid. I know ...Jan:<br />I've heard sus-sink and flas-sid. I know it's probably a losing battle, but despite the pseudo-legitimacy of the lexicographers' art, I'll suck-sinktly keep to the old-time religion; nothing flack-sid about me. If tweety-pie's sus-sessful I still won't grant it ack-session to my idiolect.Marc Leavitthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12400805396776788101noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-87242524565729139352012-11-18T09:34:52.365-05:002012-11-18T09:34:52.365-05:00Gregory, are you suggesting that even words in whi...Gregory, are you suggesting that even words in which the ks sound is spelled x can sometimes be subject to the same loss of k sound?<br />emptyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04513102801380602436noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-14905697488954660602012-11-18T08:01:18.148-05:002012-11-18T08:01:18.148-05:00A secondary accent on the preceding vowel seems to...A secondary accent on the preceding vowel seems to prevent the loss of <i>k</i> in <i>taxation, mixology, doxology, accentuate, facsimile, tuxedo.</i>Gregory Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11293280236115306205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-58348458621827789652012-11-17T23:28:25.012-05:002012-11-17T23:28:25.012-05:00In the examples accident, vaccinate, coccyx, where...In the examples <i>accident, vaccinate, coccyx</i>, where <i>ks</i> remains, the accent precedes <i>ks</i>, but in the examples where the <i>k</i> is lost, the accent follows. I conjecture that following accent is a conditioning factor for the change. <b>empty</b>'s examples <i>access, accessible</i>, the first with preceding accent and the second with following accent, display the predicted alternation between <i>ks</i> and <i>s</i> in the same morpheme.Gregory Leehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11293280236115306205noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-85190082785057381922012-11-17T21:59:25.935-05:002012-11-17T21:59:25.935-05:00But to answer the question, no, I don't recall...But to answer the question, no, I don't recall ever hearing "sussessful". I hear "assessible", which sounds odd to me (maybe because there is a word "assess"), and also "sussinct" which for some reason sounds less odd. I wonder if "coccyx" will ever be pronounced "cossicks". emptyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04513102801380602436noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-40028926341532629932012-11-17T19:37:06.556-05:002012-11-17T19:37:06.556-05:00That's nothing! Your own dear Boston Globe'...That's nothing! Your own dear Boston Globe's automated phone system for dealing with billing and delivery matters used to feature a recorded voice that pronounced the word "subscription" as if it was "suscription".emptyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04513102801380602436noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8811866763970314328.post-24248368071892901492012-11-17T18:26:06.632-05:002012-11-17T18:26:06.632-05:00It really is never too late to learn - just a few ...It really is never too late to learn - just a few days short of forty-five and I learn that "sussinct" is non-standard! Now to find out whether it's just my idiolect, or a more widespread NZE thing.mehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09042500344000182850noreply@blogger.com